Haley reportedly splits with Interscope

[Miguel]

"Club owners pay the Performance Rights Organizations a flat annual license fee that allows artists to perform copyrighted music in their club. This is how any artist is able to stand up on any stage and sing a Bob Dylan song."

From a practical point of view, songwriters stand to benefit from sales if the original artist who recorded a song continues to perform it.

[makefigure8s]

"The exclusive right to publicly perform a copyrighted work means that only the copyright holder of the song (the songwriter) may, for instance, play the song in a club."

Haley might cash in if a big name were to record one of her songs from Listen Up!:

"This means, for instance, that every time Columbia Records’ version of Whitney Houston singing Dolly Parton’s song “I Will Always Love You” is played on the radio, broadcast on TV or performed by Whitney Houston in concert, it is Dolly Parton (and those who represent her) who receive the public performance royalties from the PRO. Columbia Records and Whitney get nothing."

http://www.tunecore.com/guides/sixrights

The tunecore site is mostly correct but somewhat sloppy/misleading.
The relevant copyright code reads "the owner of copyright under this title has the exclusive rights to do and to authorize any of the following:" incl. "to perform the copyrighted work publicly". This is for the copyright on the musical composition. (The missing "to authorize" and example is the misleading part at tunecore). http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/17/106

In any event, Haley can perform any of the sings on LU but she (or more likely the venue at which she performs) would be on the hook for the performance fees; the same holds for anyone else who performs the song. (She would then get a share of this fee, but shared with all other copyright owners and their publishers according to their share of ownership -- %ages may not be evenly split, but such info. is typically not public).

Of course, if one of the other copyright owners (her co-songwriters) objects then there might be a kerfuffle, but that's pretty unlikely.

There's a separate copyright on the sound recording itself.

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ETA: On the sound recording: So we have the composition (lyrics, music) and the sound recording. For LU, the sound recordings (but not the underlying song composition!) on Listen Up! are considered a work for hire and the copyright owner is 19 Recordings (and rights are likely assigned to UMG). For unreleased songs, my understanding is that Haley has the option of buying out the song by paying for production codes -- though, if possible, it might be more cost effective to simply re-record though. (US copyright registration number for LU! is SR0000702210.)

[Outcast]

An overview by a fan about what wrong, I think he totally nailed it:

http://kenny-poo.blogspot.com/2012/11/in...haley.html

[alpha7388]

No he didn't.

[Tusk]

I'm unconvinced as to the impact of social networking and twitter.

We saw how many people followed Haley yet she was only able to sell 39K after her first week's 20K sales. If half the people who followed her bought one album, 110,000 +, we might be having a different conversation.

The number of twitter followers does not translate into sales, necessarily, so not being active on twitter had minor if any impact on the outcome we have today.

It's basically a six of one half a dozen of the other situation. She took her time, gained invaluable experience in the process and created an album that she could be proud of....Or she could do like Pia and trust they will give her a good song then put on the fast track to 'hurry up and wait' ville. Strike while the iron's hot and be used by Interscope for a money grab. There's no guarantee that album would be anywhere near as good as LU, mostly because Haley would have had little if anything to do with writing the songs.

She knew she was 'trailblazing' a sound, which means she would have to convince people. Convincing people is not easy, and when she lacked, really, any backing from Mgmt. she was not allowed to have a consistent presence to establish that sound.

That had more to do with what happened IMO than, not engaging in Twitter as much as some might think she needed to. She could gain 50K more followers...so what? If they don't buy, it don't matter.

As for not 'gigging' enough...that's a hard one to argue against. Given her background in performance, she needed to be 'out there' a lot more than she was.

We don't know the full story, but suspect, finances and being responsible for travel expenses and paying band members was a factor.
Even so, I think every one realises more dates, more full band performances was needed to not only spread the word, but also hone their skills to perform together. There was never a sense of growth as a band, no opportunity to gel.
The recent performances are back to the one band member shows. I doubt that it's Haley's choice to not perform more, so I have to believe it goes back to an attitude of indiference from those who are 'responsible' for Haley.

It's too bad, but ultimately, she loses the 'shiny hat' that says "Interscope Artist" and now wears one that just says "Artist"....which, even though this sucks now, we know is for the best for Haley.

[Himm2]

Tusk what are you doing up at this ungodly hour? It's 4:36 AM here in Chicago and 2:36 in Seattle.

[Tusk]

Tusk what are you doing up at this ungodly hour? It's 4:36 AM here in Chicago and 2:36 in Seattle.

Working for yourself means unusual hours.

Besides, I've been mulling over this response. Even though it's shocking because it only happened just recently....I have to convince myself it's for the better.

If you look at it...she did everything the 'right' way and LU is an album to be proud of and many more than just her fans have said so.

I know she's squeezed as much as she can out of this whole Idol/Interscope/19 experience. Turning public opinion was a courageous goal with a high degree of difficulty. Odds were, 'they' aren't willing to listen.

In a few days we will realise and get more comfortable with this new phase of her career and see how this 'liberation' alters the course of her career. Her future is now truly in her hands and she will be able to mold it armed with the experiences and contacts she's gained from the past two years.

[Himm2]

I have no doubt it's for the better...In the long run.
Interscope/19 is a huge launching pad but now that she's launched I feel more comfortable with her orbiting the earth with solid boosters and an external (non-idol) tank. She'll be given more thrust and stargazers will be viewing her heavenly body with the world gravitating with her for years to come.

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An overview by a fan about what wrong, I think he totally nailed it:
http://kenny-poo.blogspot.com/2012/11/in...haley.html

Poo sounds a bit overly righteous and tries to make this all Haley's "fault". I don't agree with this thinking. Haley didn't want to be a flash in the pan like some Idols...she's in it for the long run and created a high-quality product. I believe the Interscope team made more mistakes than Haley. Haley's recording work was done in 2011 and her family believed the single & album would be released in January. Interscope called the shots on the delayed timing possibly for ulterior motives of not detracting from their stable of pop talent.

[My Alter Ego]

The Q was asked today about if Hales goes to another label, what about LU I did some reading on the subject. and there is a Lock out clause that allow Interscope to own the rights to LU for up to 10 years.So could her album not be releaced under a new label????????? dunno THAT WOULD SUCK

Midnight, thanks for the research. What keeps resurfacing to me is: what about the songs recorded but didn't end up on the Listen Up album (for example, the songs that we heard glimpses of, for, theoretically, the international release)? Who has ownership/rights over those?

Oops, sorry Miguel, I hadn't seen that you had already asked the question.

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"Club owners pay the Performance Rights Organizations a flat annual license fee that allows artists to perform copyrighted music in their club. This is how any artist is able to stand up on any stage and sing a Bob Dylan song."

From a practical point of view, songwriters stand to benefit from sales if the original artist who recorded a song continues to perform it.

Miguel, where did you find that info about the fee club owners pay? I ask, because, as a former (and not willing member) of a musician's union, it was my understanding that part of the dues that I paid went for royalties (I didn't mind that part). The fee that you discussed would benefit "scab" groups, but not those who are already "paying their dues" (in many ways).

[buzzenator]

A very Happy & Haley Thanksgiving to all. What a ride this last 1-1/2+ years have been following Haley's Journey. I am thankful for all of you and the fun times we have had discussing all things Haley. And we look forward to many more years of being entertained by The Slayer...long live The Queen.

Buzz:I agree with you 100%;still Hoocked on Haley forever

We missed greeting 'lovinghaleyr' and her (making an assumption here) first post on HF...welcome...is that you Hooked? We're glad you are here.

I totally agree with everything you said Buzz. Long Live Queen Haley!!

As Haliens we may not all 'think' alike, but we all 'feel' alike...yes, long live Queen Haley.

Oh my! I take a couple of days off from message boards and twitter and all heck breaks loose! Haley will be fine. Interscope will be sorry someday. I, for one, was never that happy with the lack of promotion she got from Interscope. Their loss. Again, Haley will be fine. Bigger and better things await her. With her talent the only way she can go is UP! Looking forward to what she gifts us with musically, now that she doesn't have the weight of Interscopes "Pop machine" holding her down. LONG LIVE QUEEN HALEY!!!

Suggah...see what happens when you take a few days off...it's all your fault. Ok, not all your fault...but probably a little.

Poo sounds a bit overly righteous and tries to make this all Haley's "fault". I don't agree with this thinking. Haley didn't want to be a flash in the pan like some Idols...she's in it for the long run and created a high-quality product. I believe the Interscope team made more mistakes than Haley. Haley's recording work was done in 2011 and her family believed the single & album would be released in January. Interscope called the shots on the delayed timing possibly for ulterior motives of not detracting from their stable of pop talent.

I didn't even read Poo's assessment, aka Flask Man, simply because I knew there would be some critical remarks directed at Haley...as if Poo has the correct aerial view from his mountain top blogosphere.

Time has a way of revealing true talent vs. 15 minutes of fame...in the end we all know Haley was never in it for the 15 minutes. This is a long term strategy and making excellent music is what a true artist should be about...not the fame. I'm actually glad that she has not had instant fame. The slow process purifies, clarifies, and brings out the best for a long and fruitful career. Besides, like Himm, I look forward to seeing her 'live' in smaller venues for the time being...selfish on my part.

One thing I would love to own...a jazz album of Haley and Irvin Mayfield performing together. Now that to me would be great...