CHFIL vs Undone discussion

[rmd1064]

To me this should be an eye opener for Haley (and Ole and her advisers) from the perspective of getting more recognition, accolades, door openings, etc. These types of songs connect with her fan base and future (hopefully large) fan base. Haley Reinhart IS a business now, and it may be that these types of songs are the money makers that afford her the luxury to make 'her' type of music (whatever that may be-- personnally I'm not sure what that is yet).

As I said on the other thread-- Ole call Hollywood!!

I agree that this Extra Gum song may be a game changer for Haley. But, I still wonder if Haley is getting strategic direction or guidance from....anyone? Does she have a manager or an agent? She is not signed to a label, although Ole is obviously supporting her in some ways like a label. And, I know she is connected with big name lawyer Dina LaPolt.

As noted, she is becoming a "business" now so I am hoping that someone in her circle (or someone new perhaps...) starts taking the reins a bit to move her to the next level.

[XAtlantic]

... which she does beautifully with that amazing ability to go between regular singing and head voice / falsetto, it's just perfect for a ballad to convey crying a tear and a love laid bare whether it's through heartbreak or falling in love.

Yes! The way she does it/knows how to do it is so credible every time.

[Tusk]

Wow...poor little Haley, so taken advantage of...forced to sing a song on her first record that took her to such a horrible place. Is this your story?. I seem to recall that Haley didn't like the repetitive lyrics of singing the word Undone so many times.

It's not my story, it's what she said when asked about the song and the writing of it

If it was Just about singing repetitious lyrics, like you're saying, that would cut out so many songs that she has no problem singing.... her coming single, "Better", being one

Haley has publicly said and shown she is not particularly fond of singing the song, her body language, when asked to perform it at the private party, re enforeces her hesitation to sing it... it's not merely about the repetition in the song... a way too simplistic explaination for her unwillingness to fully embrace a song that has been shown to be possibly the most popular song on Listen Up!

I don't and haven't disagreed with the contention she is in a business and owes it to herself and her career to at least give it a go, but something doesn't let her get there, in her mind... and it's not only because it's repetitious... her favorite band of all time, The Beatles, has a whole library of repetitious songs that I'm fairly sure she'd have no problems singing....

There was a long article, I'm trying to find it right now, where she talks about Undone specifically, that it was Interscope's idea to put a ballad in and that it took her to a place she was not familiar with.. it might be deleted, I've found some old links that no longer work....

But in this interview about Listen Up! The interviewer asks her about "Undone".... not only listen to her response, but look also at her body language, trying to find the right words .... even though she acknowledges the great response to it, you can see her hesitation, she even says, she might get comfortable with it the more she sings it.... (which obviously never happened, she's sung it live, maybe 5? times that we know of?)

Note, she says, "I got pulled into it"

[mercfan3]

Don't forget, Undone was written 3(?) years ago. Haley's a happy positive person. Maybe three years later, she can draw emotions from that place comfortably, or at least more comfortably than she once did, simply because she's older.

But going further, I think artists (at least good ones) have a tendency to have a sort of message about them and their music. A sad ballad might not a part of who Haley is and the message she wants to put out. And if that's the case, than regardless of whether other people like it or not, it's probably not the way for Haley to go. Because then she could lose her musical identity.

I also wonder if, for Haley, "Undone" represents the corporate nature that led to her being dropped from Interscope. Perhaps not something she wants to talk about publicly. (And obviously, this is just thinking.) But I know that there was some debate about what would be her next single, "Undone" or "Oh My" and Haley pushed quite hard for "Oh My" and then got nothing. Maybe the song simply leaves a bad taste in her mouth because of that.

[brandon70]

when I saw Haley at the Walmart signing, i told her about an unofficial poll taken by some of her fans which indicated that Undone was her most popular song on LU. She was clearly not thrilled by that and you can see her reaction here at 0:29 right after I told her. She shook her head and said "gosh no"
www.youtube.com/watch?v=ec359TSbs_w

[riley]

All I know is that Haley has grown a lot and it is working for her right now. The girl is doing a great job. Someone is supporting her (other than us) in her career. That being said she is marketable, making good choices and delivering. IMHO she is venerable right now for the first time in her career (at the ripe old age of 25) hopefully she has a brand in demand now and now can negotiate with terms more in her favor. My favorite song changes over time and so does my opinion.

[Tusk]

I agree merc, an artist has to feel like they can connect with the song in order to express it convincingly...

Another interview

Is there any song from "Listen Up!" that you struggled with creating lyrically more than the others?

Melody comes first and pretty easy for me. Once I’m in the zone it’s really fun to go back and forth and make a story happen among me and the other songwriters. I remember “Undone” was actually kind of hard because it’s such a sorrowful song and we had to write it with me and two other people. Trying to match up those feelings and make it rhyme at the same time can be a task.

---

IMHO she is venerable right now for the first time in her career (at the ripe old age of 25) hopefully she has a brand in demand now and now can negotiate with terms more in her favor. My favorite song changes over time and so does my opinion.

Covering iconic songs and classics, she's got that down pat, but as an artist, a true artist, she wants to find what she's capable of. Remember, it was said that she didn't really get into Jazz until that day she tried out as the singer for her High School Jazz band, their first Jazz vocalist which eventually took them to Umbrea Jazz Festival

I think part of what she loves about working w/ PMJ is not only do they do songs in 'classic' styles of eras past, but they also get to be inventive, infuse modern lyrics into jazz styles, so it gives her a chance to excercise her creativity, put some of herself, her personality, into the song (Creep, Ooops I did it again, 7NA are prime examples of Haley "making it her own")

I think the EP will tell us some things.... I think Haley's latest struggle might be that she wants to do more 'updated' music, maybe more R&B, perhaps a dance track. She is still very young after all, even though she adores the music of the past, her youth must call for music that is more updated, music of her generation. (Look at some of the work of her song writing contemporaries at Ole and you can see their modern take on music, with a wide variation of musical styles they explore, perhaps something Ole encourages)

We've heard some of Haley's more dance and hip hop contributions, which though is not my genre of choice, I like, but seems to have not engendered any excitement from most in her fan base

She can't be satisfied w/ being pigeon holed, whether it be as a 'cover singer' or a 'jazz singer'... Like Casey, she's trying to find where she fits in the modern world of music. "Show Me Your Moves", even though I like it (my genre is Haley ) It was apparent that many of her fans wanted her to go back to singing in the style they've grown to expect from her. Heck, I've got videos w/ more views than SMYM has

On the business end of things, Haley knows where her bread is buttered, as far as songs people like to hear her sing. But as an artist, she's too young to settle in just yet. I expect she will continue to push to find her sound, as an artist. Hopefully she can find the right mix/balance between the covers that a majority of her fans like, and the music she wants to write to represent who she thinks she is an artist in the 21st century

[JMT]

On the business end of things, Haley knows where her bread is buttered, as far as songs people like to hear her sing. But as an artist, she's too young to settle in just yet. I expect she will continue to push to find her sound, as an artist. Hopefully she can find the right mix/balance between the covers that a majority of her fans like, and the music she wants to write to represent who she thinks she is an artist in the 21st century

Very well said!! I'm very excited to hear the style of music she's created for us with the new EP. Based on what we've heard it may be evolving from what she originally had in mind. As an artist, she may always be balancing what SHE wants to sing (and write) and what her FANS want to hear. Especially for someone who can 'sing the phone book' and make it sound awesome. If it was up to me, she'd be singing ROCK!!! But it's not and, as a fan, I'll happily take anything she gives me.

When she eventually starts to tour on her own, she may find that she'll need to sing Undone-- to satisfy some of her fans. By that time, maybe enough time will have passed to have diminished the sting of Interscope (I do agree that that could have had some impact on her feelings about it) that she'll pull it off. Heck, Jiimmy Page wasn't thrilled with Stairway to Heaven, but still gladly played it because the masses wanted him to....

[JMT]

But, I still wonder if Haley is getting strategic direction or guidance from....anyone? Does she have a manager or an agent? She is not signed to a label, although Ole is obviously supporting her in some ways like a label. And, I know she is connected with big name lawyer Dina LaPolt.

As noted, she is becoming a "business" now so I am hoping that someone in her circle (or someone new perhaps...) starts taking the reins a bit to move her to the next level.

I wonder (and worry) about this also. Right now Haley, Ole, and Haley's association with PMJ are heading in the same direction. But there will be a time down the road (maybe soon) when that won't be the case. Haley needs someone who works ONLY for her own benefit. IMO she needs a full-time manager, and I hope that will happen soon. She's such a nice person, you don't want her to have to be the 'heavy'.

[Tusk]

Re: Management

At Laguna she was very excited to tell us that she's begun the process of looking for management, ready to hand off some responsibility to others. She had already started the interview process, a big caveat being that if they didn't include plans for an EP tour, then they weren't in consideration.

That was in June. Something changed from then to now, I doubt it was CHFIL and the Extra gum ad.

I think, my opinion, Haley's profile blew up significantly since then mainly because of PMJ, their videos and tour. I think Ole, with new information, decided that they might want to invest more effort into the EP, thus bringing Anders back twice from the UK to work on the single and EP. Even as soon as July, when Haley was at the Troubadour, with a full band, it looked like they were ramping up for a release of the EP. But since then, outside of the Casey Curry photoshoot, it seems like something changed....